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Free Agents Still Available The O's Could Plausibly Sign


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#1 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 12:07 PM

SP: Wood, McHugh, Nova, Cashner, Walker, Salazar

 

RP: Cishek, Liriano, Strop, Rondon, Albers, Hunter, Cahill, Holland

 

Infield: Iglesias, Hechavarria, Kipnis, Holt, Russell, Dozier, T. Beckham, Torreyes, Mercer

 

 

 

- Walker and Salazar fliers only. Certainly couldn't expect anything. 

 

- I like a lot of the bullpen arms the Orioles already have, but not opposed to another vet.

 

- Several of the infielders mentioned are 2nd baseman. Idea there would be Alberto to 3rd where I think he looked better defensively. Holt, Torreyes, Beckham could be UTI / 26th man types. 

 

- Would still like to have Wood and McHugh.  Iglesias a legitimate SS. 

 

 

Other FA's still out there if you want to get 'crazy' with not-happening hypotheticals... Donaldson, Gordon, Ozuna, Puig, Castellanos. 



#2 Mike B

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 12:11 PM

I have been hoping for McHugh for awhile.  

I don't expect anything that will cost over 1M.


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#3 dude

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 12:34 PM

I don't expect anything that will cost over 1M.

 

I think this is correct.

 

Part of getting the guys they've been getting is you have them at ML minimum. 

I don't think they see a reason to spend anything more than the minimum.

 

They can field a team right now.



#4 Mike B

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 12:45 PM

I think this is correct.

 

Part of getting the guys they've been getting is you have them at ML minimum. 

I don't think they see a reason to spend anything more than the minimum.

 

They can field a team right now.

Another embarrassing one.


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#5 dude

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 01:31 PM

Another embarrassing one.

 

...but very intentional.  They may have a very different perspective on what they are doing. 



#6 BSLRobShields

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 01:57 PM

...but very intentional. They may have a very different perspective on what they are doing.


To be clear, this is about ownership. You seem to want to put this on Elias but ownership is a big road block here.
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#7 Mike B

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 02:03 PM

To be clear, this is about ownership. You seem to want to put this on Elias but ownership is a big road block here.

I go back and forth on this, only because it is exactly what Houston did.  They got the payroll down to 26 M


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#8 dude

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Posted 04 January 2020 - 04:48 PM

To be clear, this is about ownership. You seem to want to put this on Elias but ownership is a big road block here.

 

Not sure why you think I want to put this on Elias.

 

imo, this is only about ownership preservation.



#9 FFH

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 07:25 AM

The O's suck right now because this is a part of the plan.

However, outside of Villar, I think they've made a bunch of high-quality moves, based on their current plan and position. 

Stewart, for one, is a fantastic move with a ton of upside.  I also think Bailey and Rucker are about as interesting as you can get for Rule 5 guys.

 

I expect there will be some signings late in the season, similar to Stewart, with holdouts that were hoping for better contracts.  I would also like to see them take a flyer on Cashner with a high-incentive one-year contract.

 

I think they still need another middle infielder - defense first - to round out the team....but they should be able to find someone.


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#10 BSLRobShields

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 08:06 AM

Not sure why you think I want to put this on Elias.

imo, this is only about ownership preservation.


Because of your comments all the time. “Houston tried to lose 100 games for 3 years” and things along those lines. That definitely seems to be you saying, Elias was part of this before and he wants to do it here.


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#11 Mike B

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 09:34 AM

I do not think he wants to lose 100 games, but I do not think he is losing 1 minutes sleep worrying about losing 100 games.  He is clearly following the blue print.  My only issue with Elias, is the heavy handed way he does things.


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#12 BSLRobShields

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 09:38 AM

I do not think he wants to lose 100 games, but I do not think he is losing 1 minutes sleep worrying about losing 100 games.  He is clearly following the blue print.  My only issue with Elias, is the heavy handed way he does things.


What is he doing heavy handed?
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#13 dude

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 10:52 AM

Because of your comments all the time. “Houston tried to lose 100 games for 3 years” and things along those lines. That definitely seems to be you saying, Elias was part of this before and he wants to do it here.

 

Elias certainly wants to lose like they did in Houston.  That's what they learned.  It doesn't really matter that 'rebuilding' in Houston had/has little to do with current success.  It's easy to take this approach.  Fans like it, there's no accountability, there's no pressure, and you actually get CREDIT for being bad. 

 

Imagine having a job where performing poorly was actually the goal.  Houston was the first, but it's clearly been developed as a model around MLB and I think that has more to do with a collective approach (expectation management) today than winning ever.

 

...but I think the hyper-money management in the current process is all about [John and Lou] concern over resourcing the Estate transition.  There's only 2 ways to manage the number, have more resources or justify a lower valuation.  League resourcing has exploded franchise value in the last 5 years (you had a big bump after 2014 and after 2016).  If your Estate transition was built around 800M and you are at 1.4B and your wealth is tied up in assets, not cash, I'd imagine you have something to work on if you want to keep control of the franchise.  You can't be in a weak position, especially if the League isn't in your corner.

 

What that generally means is that Elias is something of a pawn in this.  He's doing exactly what he wants to do and the endstate of that is exactly what John and Lou need to happen for a specifically different purpose.

 

...as I said before, I think we're still playing Game of Thrones.  I could be wrong.  We'll see.



#14 dude

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 11:22 AM

Specifically as it relates to the money comments....

 

I'd guess Elias would actually like to use money to bump up prospect acquisition.

 

We've already seen it in the Angels deal and we literally had just completed a deal with them.  Somebody missed an opportunity there.  For years, we've (as a group) been able to go to our corners and argue the influences of different things.  This has nothing to do with Peter, Buck, Andy, Dan or Brady.  It has nothing to do with media influences or Palmer or any of the outlets.  

 

There's John and Lou and they've hired Mike and everyone else is out of the game.

 

The Orioles can handle a 150-160M active payroll.  Maybe you decrement that because you are busy trashing your attendance, but the Orioles have the larger position of the Nationals media revenue and the Nationals are spending 200M....and they are doing all of the other stuff too.  You aren't saving money for later, that isn't a thing.

 

It's a fact that there's money available to work with.  To sign modest veterans, to take bad contracts, to do more in terms of creating opportunity.

 

You literally just came out of a deal with the Angels (Bundy) where you could have absolutely taken a contract (Cozart) to get something more significant back.

 

You are left with 2 options...

 

It's either on Elias and he doesn't want to do it (doesn't understand how to do it, his analytics don't support it, he's afraid Zach Cozart will make them too good, he's simply a slave to his process, ....something)

 

...or John and Lou told him he's not allowed to spend any money (and we maybe still have to go lower).

 

There is no other ground to stand on.



#15 BSLRobShields

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 11:34 AM

Well, I disagree with that.

It’s definitely possible the Os scouts didn’t love the prospect that SF bought and if he does find a deal like that where he loves the prospect, he can pull the trigger.

I personally don’t believe it but it’s certainly “another ground to stand on”
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#16 dude

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 01:56 PM

Well, I disagree with that.

It’s definitely possible the Os scouts didn’t love the prospect that SF bought and if he does find a deal like that where he loves the prospect, he can pull the trigger.

I personally don’t believe it but it’s certainly “another ground to stand on”

 

You're suggesting that the only player the Orioles could have gotten for taking Cozart of Will Wilson.

 

That's not really ground you think anyone should stand on, is it?

 

Beyond that, the Orioles keep talking about adding another MI.  Cozart used to be good.  If he got some opportunity (easy for the Orioles) and proved healthy and somewhat effective, you could probably dump some of the remaining contract later.

 

It's a miss at so many levels.  Someone messed it up.  I don't think it was me or you.



#17 BSLRobShields

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 02:07 PM

You're suggesting that the only player the Orioles could have gotten for taking Cozart of Will Wilson.
 
That's not really ground you think anyone should stand on, is it?
 
Beyond that, the Orioles keep talking about adding another MI.  Cozart used to be good.  If he got some opportunity (easy for the Orioles) and proved healthy and somewhat effective, you could probably dump some of the remaining contract later.
 
It's a miss at so many levels.  Someone messed it up.  I don't think it was me or you.


It may have been a miss..but if you don’t like the player, you don’t make this move.

It’s that simple.
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#18 dude

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 02:24 PM

It may have been a miss..but if you don’t like the player, you don’t make this move.

It’s that simple.

 

Will Wilson represents some level of value inside of their system.  It doesn't have to be Will Wilson.

 

Jeremy already pointed out that their system depth (depth they will use for something other than playing time on the Angels) is centered around OF and MI players.  

 

Or who cares, go get 4 more unrated players from the 2018 and 2019 drafts.

 

You seem to want to find a angle where the 0% case has merit.

 

It doesn't.



#19 BSLRobShields

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 02:28 PM

Will Wilson represents some level of value inside of their system.  It doesn't have to be Will Wilson.
 
Jeremy already pointed out that their system depth (depth they will use for something other than playing time on the Angels) is centered around OF and MI players.  
 
Or who cares, go get 4 more unrated players from the 2018 and 2019 drafts.
 
You seem to want to find a angle where the 0% case has merit.
 
It doesn't.


No, you said there is no other ground to stand on for that deal.

You are wrong..or you misrepresented what you meant.

The Giants made the deal because the player was worth taking on the bad contract in their eyes.

The Orioles may feel that Wilson isn’t that good...or isn’t good enough to take on the money.

I’m sure they would have taken Adell in the deal.

Again, I don’t think this is the case..I think this is 100% on the Angelos family. I’m just saying that there are more options in play here.


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#20 dude

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Posted 05 January 2020 - 03:40 PM

It's not about Will Wilson.  Please stop. 

 

Please don't suggest the ONLY guy the Angels were to deal with Cozart is Wilson.

 

The Angels were willing to deal a top 5 prospect in their system, from their depth, to shed Cozart. They did it to free up the roster spot and dump the 13M.  They have plenty of money, but the money was still important enough to deal one of their top prospects for him.

 

We were willing to trade for recent draft picks not in their top30 for Dylan Bundy and his modest salary.

 

Were those 4 guys the ONLY 4 guys worth trading for in the Angels system?  Those 4?






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