Photo

Addison Russell


  • Please log in to reply
65 replies to this topic

#61 dude

dude

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,940 posts
  • LocationColumbus, GA

Posted 04 January 2020 - 05:33 PM

I guess my thinking on that is...  numerous teams would be signing Russell now without the off-field concerns. 

 

If the O's were the team to jump... and if over the 1st half of the season he's playing well, and there are no off-field issues.... it becomes easier for teams to be the next team.

 

....but he's already had ML roster time since his suspension.  The Cubs paid him and brought him back.  He played 5 months last season.

 

He didn't play great (.699 OPS), but he was back in uniform.

 

He's got/had a new (3rd) baby momma (Asti Kelley) who says good things and doesn't understand what the issues were ('I haven't seen them').  I think they go back 2 years now.

-----------------

 

My bigger issue with the Orioles is you don't really have anyone that, if you wanted him, could provide coverage for him.

 

If you had a guy like Adam Jones, he could basically say, "I got this" and act as his public confidence. 



#62 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,779 posts

Posted 07 January 2020 - 10:47 AM

If you think 100 times the crime deserves half the time, I'm not sure what to tell you.  

 

I'm not invested in it in any direction.  If they gave him a lifetime suspension, that's OK with me and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

 

I have a number of issues with the inconsistency of things that were done and said, but I can account for those in different ways.

 

What you can't really account for is MLB doing the minimum, the Cubs holding on and the Players staying in his corner in a case that would seem to carry the maximum penalty and generally the opposite of what happened.

 

You are one that has been outspoken about how terrible a person he is.  You angst isn't with me, I'm only taking my cue from MLB.

 

You seem to believe you have more insight into the situation than MLB Investigators.

 

You've indicated you'd take your judgement over the judgement of Brandon Hyde who was on that team, at that time, with him.

 

 

You are making the following logical jumps:

  • that Russell was accused of something 100 times worse than German
  • that MLB applies suspensions equally and consistently based solely on accusations without accounting for what can be substantiated
  • your perception of what the Cubs not releasing him means
  • your perception of what his teammates, coaches, and front office management not publicly denouncing him means
  • your hypothetical assumption that Brandon Hyde wants or signs off on him
  • that he apologizes publicly for his past actions (that he didn't do) because <reasons>

in order to to reach the conclusion that his ex-wife made everything up which would make it ok to sign him to play shortstop.

 

 

I am making one logical jump of believing that Russell apologizing for his actions after everything became public means that he did the things she accused him of doing.

 

 

I can account for MLB issuing a smaller suspension by it being a year-and-a-half ago before they had made many long suspensions without a legal charge and the accusations being mostly uncorroboratable accusations.  It's largely he-said, she-said and I doubt Russell did a lot of confessing before the suspension was handed out.  Domingo German reportedly had witnesses to his incident so there isn't as much uncertainty.  So even if what he did was much less, he definitely did it without ambiguity.  MLB suspended Russell based on accusations that didn't have that concrete evidence.  I believe his ex-wife, partially because I think we as the public should default to believing women in these cases unless there is some strong reason not to rather than default to consider them lying (note: public perception, not legal guilt) and because Russell apologized for the things he had done.  That he didn't say specifically what he had done or bullet-point by bullet-point admit to each accusation does not make me think his wife is a liar.


  • DJ MC likes this

#63 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,779 posts

Posted 07 January 2020 - 10:58 AM

...and yet Russell got half the suspension that [one-time-incident] guys like Osuna and German (and others) got.

 

So you look around and see where there's any other corroborating actions.

 

What did the Cubs do?  Theo? Maddon? Team-mates?  All of them could have simply (and easily) walked away, but they choose not to.

 

Apply each question to Ray Rice before the last video came out.

 

He gets arrested (so a difference there) but no concrete details are publicly known (lots of rumors though)

Coaches, GM, owner, players support him publicly

Girlfriend married him and her family stood by him

Rice vaguely apologizes, doesn't admit to anything in particular publicly

He gets a two game suspension from the league after an investigation, Ravens take no further team-action

 

 

For me, Russell apologizing is equal to seeing the video.  Most should have believed her earlier, or at the very least not assumed that the woman involved was making false accusations, but by now everyone should believe.

 

I'll believe Russell when he says he did it.  Not sure why you don't.  I guess you could think that not only is his wife lying about him doing these things, but he's lying about having done them.  Seems like an odd thing to lie about in his situation, but I guess you could make the argument that by corroborating her lie he ends the story and begins moving towards redemption somehow?



#64 dude

dude

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,940 posts
  • LocationColumbus, GA

Posted 07 January 2020 - 10:22 PM

I'll believe Russell when he says he did it.  

 

You seem to have worked to this angle to justify your position. 

 

The post before it you indicated "That he didn't say specifically what he had done" so I'm not sure he said what you think he said here.

 

I think there's room for both poor behavior on the part of Russell (for example: cheating) and she created retribution to punish his behavior because she's pissed.  My guess would be there's truth to certain things that happened and she put a DV spin on everything.

 

He's never going to win in the court or public opinion after the accusation (your response) and she made sure she never had to be accountable for anything she said (she passed on every opportunity) in a forum where there'd be consideration for both sides.

 

I think every Image Management company in the country would tell him to apologize, cop to something for accountability and get it behind you.  Don't fight when you can't win.

 

I'm happy to discuss this more, although there isn't much point to it since he's not going to be an Oriole.

 

The only thing I'd add is I'm not sure we should get out the torches and pitchforks (and that's what was happening early on this here) when we're presented with uncorroborated, he-said, she-said statements that weren't harshly judged by those closest to the situation (the Cubs and MLB investigators).  Her accusations should have warranted more severe consequences. If he was given a lifetime ban, I wouldn't care. I'll stand by my position that IF Hyde was OK with signing him, there's no reason for me not to be OK with it.

 

That can be my last post on this (or not).



#65 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,779 posts

Posted 08 January 2020 - 04:05 PM

The only thing I'd add is I'm not sure we should get out the torches and pitchforks (and that's what was happening early on this here) when we're presented with uncorroborated, he-said, she-said statements that weren't harshly judged by those closest to the situation (the Cubs and MLB investigators).  Her accusations should have warranted more severe consequences. If he was given a lifetime ban, I wouldn't care. I'll stand by my position that IF Hyde was OK with signing him, there's no reason for me not to be OK with it.

 

That can be my last post on this (or not).

 

 

Not every accusation is credible.  But unless there is a strong and direct reason to find the accuser to not be credible, and I don't think there is any in this case, I'll err on the side of believing the woman.  Especially when the accused comes out and apologizes for "past actions".  All of the mitigating factors you are bringing up have at least one other subjective party in between (Cubs, MLB) the act and your opinion on it.  

 

There are lots of shortstops out there.  I don't have to sign one who has this stink on him.   I'd need more evidence against Russell than his ex-wife's accusations and descriptions if I was sitting on a jury deciding whether or not to send him to prison.  But we're not deciding to send him to prison or not.  We're deciding if we'd sign him to play baseball for us.  I've seen more than enough against him to be very comfortable in deciding that he isn't someone I'd sign to play for my baseball team if I ran one.  That burden of proof is much lower.


  • Mike B and DJ MC like this

#66 dude

dude

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,940 posts
  • LocationColumbus, GA

Posted 08 January 2020 - 09:25 PM

<<I want to acknowledge your post without additional comment>>






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users

Partners