Photo

Ravens win in Seattle; 5-2 with New England Next (Post-Game Thoughts)


  • Please log in to reply
82 replies to this topic

#61 Mike B

Mike B

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,789 posts
  • LocationTowson Md.

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:01 AM

It's possible to be a fan of a player and still be critical of him/identify areas that need improvement.

Understood.  The Ravens reverted to their roots yesterday and ran the ball down the Seahawks throats..  Given the conditions, lack of attempts and the drops, it does not seem fair, IMO, to say Lamar was "awful" throwing the ball.


  • BSLMikeRandall, BSLGabeFerguson and ravens82 like this
@mikeghg

#62 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,190 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:08 AM

His passing was pretty awful. His completion percentage, even without the drops, wouldn’t have been good.

 

Strongly disagree with this.  

 

9/20 with somewhere between 3 and 5 drops depending on how harshly you grade drops.  I thought Andrews' one in the end zone and then the two straight bricks afterwards were all nice throws.  So those three alone get you to 12/20. 

 

He did have two throws that I recall early on that were a bit off the mark that receivers made nice plays on for catches.  Not balls that should have gone incomplete, but plays that weren't routine for the receiver.   Maybe there were others.

 

Overall, I thought Lamar threw the ball somewhere between fine and well yesterday.  I thought he was much better than "pretty awful".


  • BSLSeanJester and ravens82 like this

#63 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,190 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:11 AM

I don't think you can apply QBR to Jackson as far as overall effectiveness.  He isn't a QB that fits the mold for which that formula is designed.  Maybe you can apply it just to the passing game, but not to his total worth in any game. 

 

QBR accounts for quarterbacks rushing.  QB Rating does not.

 

Fair to question how accurately QBR accounts for rushing.  I think it's very possible that Lamar does indeed break the model as he's such an extreme outlier in terms of rushing attempts and yards gained.  It's way more than just adding some scrambles.



#64 jamesdean

jamesdean

    Veteran

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 975 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:20 AM

Understood.  The Ravens reverted to their roots yesterday and ran the ball down the Seahawks throats..  Given the conditions, lack of attempts and the drops, it does not seem fair, IMO, to say Lamar was "awful" throwing the ball.

Agreed.  With the drops and the overall weather conditions, it wasn't exactly a day to get into any kind of throwing rhythm.  Offensively, they didn't do much(outside of Lamar) until the 4th quarter when they finally started to wear down the Seattle front 7.  



#65 BSLJordanKough

BSLJordanKough

    Ravens Analyst

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,727 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:22 AM

QBR accounts for quarterbacks rushing.  QB Rating does not.

 

Fair to question how accurately QBR accounts for rushing.  I think it's very possible that Lamar does indeed break the model as he's such an extreme outlier in terms of rushing attempts and yards gained.  It's way more than just adding some scrambles.

 

I'd think the 3rd and 15 run to 4th and 2 might not have been valued as high, but otherwise, I thought QBR takes the value of the run and essentially makes it the same as a pass. My understanding was that it's a combo of adjusted to down, distance and success.

 

Also it's a hard scale of 100, so a 73 is actually pretty good. 8th best on the week (I think that's fair with the drops) and would be 5th best if you look at total year QBR. 



#66 Mike B

Mike B

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,789 posts
  • LocationTowson Md.

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:35 AM

Getting off Lamar, there were plenty of other guys who stood out.  

Jaylon Ferguson flashed yesterday and he seems to be making progress.

Bynes and Fort were terrific.  They are not the most athletic duo, but they are physical, seem to always be in the right spot. and both are solid tacklers.

Jihad Ward.  He did a nice job holding the edge.  He looks real physical, when in the game.

Peters and Humphrey...two huge plays, that swung the game.

Brandon Williams....the Seahawks had fits trying to block him yesterday

The Oline, good job run blocking. nice seal blocks, from Bozeman on two of the Lamar runs, including the TD.

Mark Ingram and Gus Bell.....not big numbers but they ran hard,  Also check on Ingram picking up Clowney.  He freed Lamar from one of his dashes with a great rush pick up.

The Ravens are back to be a physical football team.  


@mikeghg

#67 ravens82

ravens82
  • Members
  • 367 posts
  • LocationEllicott City, MD

Posted 21 October 2019 - 11:56 AM

Video context on the "drops":  https://twitter.com/...257395649044480

 

Just for the record, I only count 3 of those as drops, but it's interesting to watch.



#68 85Knight

85Knight

    Rookie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 570 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:29 PM

Jackson was 9/20 passing. Of the 11 missed passes at least 3 were placed perfectly. Andrews had a terrible day with drops. Wish they would go to Hurst/Boyle more.


When you factor in the kind of day Russell Wilson had you have to think it was a tough day passing and catching the football.

#69 85Knight

85Knight

    Rookie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 570 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:31 PM

Video context on the "drops": https://twitter.com/...257395649044480

Just for the record, I only count 3 of those as drops, but it's interesting to watch.


Man, Andrews had a horrible day.

#70 BSLGabeFerguson

BSLGabeFerguson

    Ravens Analyst

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,384 posts
  • LocationCity of Angels

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:53 PM

Video context on the "drops":  https://twitter.com/...257395649044480

 

Just for the record, I only count 3 of those as drops, but it's interesting to watch.

I'd count 4 as drops, 3 to Andrews and the one to Snead. The low balls to Andrews and and Roberts were not catchable imo. 


@gabefergy

#71 BSLJordanKough

BSLJordanKough

    Ravens Analyst

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,727 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:56 PM

I'd count 4 as drops, 3 to Andrews and the one to Snead. The low balls to Andrews and and Roberts were not catchable imo. 

 

There was also the low ball to Hurst, too. Regardless, the ball was in the vicinity given conditions in many instances and if we go back to that "uncatchable" stat that Rob had found. I think he faired pretty well on the overall "catchable" throws. 



#72 hallas

hallas
  • Members
  • 440 posts
  • LocationSomewhere around LA

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:58 PM

Video context on the "drops":  https://twitter.com/...257395649044480

 

Just for the record, I only count 3 of those as drops, but it's interesting to watch.

 

I thought 4 of those were drops.  1 2 3 and 6.  I guess the ball in the end zone you could have argued was a good play by the DB but he has to make that play imo.  The 2 low balls were catchable but given the rain and the fact that they were at his shoelaces I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.  Either Andrews was having a severe off-day or he is more affected by the rain than others.  Either way he probably needs to figure out what to do the next time it rains.  Or god forbid he plays in the snow.



#73 DuffMan

DuffMan

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,864 posts
  • LocationLinthicum, MD

Posted 21 October 2019 - 12:59 PM

Lamar was a beast, but for me the critical play of the game was the pick 6. 



#74 ravens82

ravens82
  • Members
  • 367 posts
  • LocationEllicott City, MD

Posted 21 October 2019 - 01:08 PM

Lamar was a beast, but for me the critical play of the game was the pick 6. 

 

The Pick 6 was amazing to watch, but the 4th and 2 play for the TD is the one for me.  Harbs recalling the FG unit and then going with a G-Ro special, 10 blockers, no one in the backfield but Lamar.  They executed perfectly and took control of the game for good.


  • DuffMan likes this

#75 hallas

hallas
  • Members
  • 440 posts
  • LocationSomewhere around LA

Posted 21 October 2019 - 01:17 PM

QBR accounts for quarterbacks rushing.  QB Rating does not.

 

Fair to question how accurately QBR accounts for rushing.  I think it's very possible that Lamar does indeed break the model as he's such an extreme outlier in terms of rushing attempts and yards gained.  It's way more than just adding some scrambles.

 

QBR // QB rating?  I think you mean passer rating?  QBR literally stands for QB Rating  :mrgreen:



#76 ravens82

ravens82
  • Members
  • 367 posts
  • LocationEllicott City, MD

Posted 21 October 2019 - 01:27 PM

The Pick 6 was amazing to watch, but the 4th and 2 play for the TD is the one for me.  Harbs recalling the FG unit and then going with a G-Ro special, 10 blockers, no one in the backfield but Lamar.  They executed perfectly and took control of the game for good.

 

Just re-watched the play, Hurst did line up in the backfield, but immediately went to block: https://youtu.be/x7JquiB4Rgs?t=367



#77 Mackus

Mackus

    HOF

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 42,190 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 01:28 PM

QBR // QB rating?  I think you mean passer rating?  QBR literally stands for QB Rating  :mrgreen:

 

QB Rating and Passer Rating are two terms for the same thing.

https://en.wikipedia...i/Passer_rating

 

QBR is something else.

https://en.wikipedia...rterback_rating



#78 hallas

hallas
  • Members
  • 440 posts
  • LocationSomewhere around LA

Posted 21 October 2019 - 01:34 PM

QB Rating and Passer Rating are two terms for the same thing.
https://en.wikipedia...i/Passer_rating

QBR is something else.
https://en.wikipedia...rterback_rating

I personally try and distinguish the two by sticking with “passer rating” for the old school stat and “QBR” / “Total QB Rating” for the newer stat. It’s too confusing to distinguish between “total qb rating” and “qb rating.”

#79 BSLRobShields

BSLRobShields

    BSL Analyst

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 86,193 posts
  • LocationBaltimore

Posted 21 October 2019 - 02:09 PM

Strongly disagree with this.

9/20 with somewhere between 3 and 5 drops depending on how harshly you grade drops. I thought Andrews' one in the end zone and then the two straight bricks afterwards were all nice throws. So those three alone get you to 12/20.

He did have two throws that I recall early on that were a bit off the mark that receivers made nice plays on for catches. Not balls that should have gone incomplete, but plays that weren't routine for the receiver. Maybe there were others.

Overall, I thought Lamar threw the ball somewhere between fine and well yesterday. I thought he was much better than "pretty awful".


As Gabe said, even on balls that he completed, the passes were off.

The deep ball to Boykin was under-thrown although it was tough throw to make.

He was throwing low a lot. He had passes dropped but also missed some throws. He also had some very nice catches made that in some ways make up for the easy drops.

Still, the conditions weren’t exactly favorable either and that has to be factored in as well.

No doubt his numbers should have been better though.
@BSLRobShields

#80 BSLJordanKough

BSLJordanKough

    Ravens Analyst

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,727 posts

Posted 21 October 2019 - 02:25 PM

As Gabe said, even on balls that he completed, the passes were off.

The deep ball to Boykin was under-thrown although it was tough throw to make.

He was throwing low a lot. He had passes dropped but also missed some throws. He also had some very nice catches made that in some ways make up for the easy drops.

Still, the conditions weren’t exactly favorable either and that has to be factored in as well.

No doubt his numbers should have been better though.

 

I don't agree with either of the bolded here. The Boykin throw as short because the defender pushed Boykin in the back when he beat him up the field. it threw off the timing and forced Boykin to get ahead of where he was trying to spot. I thought all in all that was actually a pretty good throw on a deep ball. 

 

As for he threw a lot...he threw it 20 times. Maybe you meant to say he didn't throw a lot...not sure. 

 

There were not as many "tough catches" as there were "easy drops" though. Both of the first three completions came on the first drive and the Roberts and Boykin catches were short and simple. Then Moore had the catch on the swing out to the right on the next play, also not a hard catch. The deep pass to Andrews that he actually caught. not hard. Then Andrews on the short out where he didn't get to the sticks and was stopped short. The Hurst catch was a tough one, that was one was in traffic and a guy on his hip. Ingram on the short pass on 2 and 15 and the short flat to Boyle who was wide open and ran 20 after the catch. 

 

I remember Roberts first catch was a bit low and that the Hurst catch was a really good one but the rest of them, there was no swinging luck in the Ravens favor on the 9 catches he did have to balance out the 4-6 drops, IMO. 


  • bmore_ken and ravens82 like this




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Partners