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BSL: Can Chris Davis be Saved?


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#121 85Knight

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Posted 12 April 2019 - 09:14 PM

The real question is, "Is Chris Davis' futility the biggest reason for the O's failure the past few years?"

My answer is yes. The team's downfall directly correlates with his demise to get us to where we're at right now. Worst move in team history.

#122 BSLMikeRandall

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Posted 12 April 2019 - 10:31 PM

The real question is, "Is Chris Davis' futility the biggest reason for the O's failure the past few years?"

My answer is yes. The team's downfall directly correlates with his demise to get us to where we're at right now. Worst move in team history.

No. Davis didn't leave Britton in the pen. 

 

Seriously though, they did this as a team. The downfall was, IMO, other teams getting smarter analytically and internationally. While the Orioles never bothered. Every player that went elsewhere in the trade dump was blown away by how other teams prepare. The Orioles were behind in games before they even took the field. 

 

Now that the Orioles are on even playing field, the next step is finding players. And Davis is occupying a spot that could be for someone else to prove they belong, because we know he doesn't. 

 

As bad as he is though, you win and lose as a team. Mike Trout doesn't get the Angels to the playoffs, and Davis isn't why they lose 100 games. He'll be the reason they lose 10 or 11 of those games, but not 100.


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#123 Ravens2006

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Posted 12 April 2019 - 10:44 PM

It may not mean much, but the post game show was harping on his two outs as 97 and 105 MPH off the bat. Hope springs eternal.


Was it Melewski? Heard him babbling that nonsense a couple days ago too. I'm already done with the analytics talk in EVERYTHING. A guy's batting average tells me more than his exit velocity. And Davis with his current 0-fer and 1-fer streak spanning two seasons tells us all that is needed... he's not a major league caliber hitter right now and hasn't been for a while. They're literally giving away free outs just because he is expensive. It's a stupid thing to continue doing...
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#124 85Knight

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Posted 12 April 2019 - 11:28 PM

No. Davis didn't leave Britton in the pen.

Seriously though, they did this as a team. The downfall was, IMO, other teams getting smarter analytically and internationally. While the Orioles never bothered. Every player that went elsewhere in the trade dump was blown away by how other teams prepare. The Orioles were behind in games before they even took the field.

Now that the Orioles are on even playing field, the next step is finding players. And Davis is occupying a spot that could be for someone else to prove they belong, because we know he doesn't.

As bad as he is though, you win and lose as a team. Mike Trout doesn't get the Angels to the playoffs, and Davis isn't why they lose 100 games. He'll be the reason they lose 10 or 11 of those games, but not 100.


Very good points. I would rate not putting Britton in the playoff game against the Blue Jays as the 2nd biggest reason for the demise. It was definitely Showalter's worst move.

#125 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 06:44 AM

Davis's ball had an expected .970 batting average based on exit velocity and launch angle.

#126 Dystopia

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 07:59 AM

Davis's ball had an expected .970 batting average based on exit velocity and launch angle.

Does that mean his ball would have been a hit 97% of time based off his EV and LA?



#127 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 08:11 AM

Does that mean his ball would have been a hit 97% of time based off his EV and LA?

 

Yep, although with the shift, it's a hit 0% of the time.



#128 Mackus

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 09:01 AM

The real question is, "Is Chris Davis' futility the biggest reason for the O's failure the past few years?"

My answer is yes. The team's downfall directly correlates with his demise to get us to where we're at right now. Worst move in team history.

Single biggest reason? Yes.

But he's still just one small piece of the larger failure pie.

#129 bmore_ken

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 12:08 PM

The real question is, "Is Chris Davis' futility the biggest reason for the O's failure the past few years?"

My answer is yes. The team's downfall directly correlates with his demise to get us to where we're at right now. Worst move in team history.

Totally disagree. The team of the last few years had horrible starting pitching. There were plenty of other bats to cover for Davis's lack of production. When your starting pitching can't go five innings consistently, you're going to lose a lot.



#130 85Knight

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 02:23 PM

Totally disagree. The team of the last few years had horrible starting pitching. There were plenty of other bats to cover for Davis's lack of production. When your starting pitching can't go five innings consistently, you're going to lose a lot.


The hitting is only part of it. His contract has handcuffed the team and contributed to the fire sale and rebuild. On the field the all or nothing offense was a bigger problem than the pitching but I don't want to start that argument again.

#131 Ravens2006

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 03:51 PM

The pitching stunk too often, and the all or nothing offense stunk too often. Hence why they lost 243 games last year.

I'll continue to maintain that the Jimenez over Britton decision, given the game situation and the importance of that situation... your season ends with a guy leading off 3rd and about 75 feet from home plate... was THE worst managerial move I've ever seen. But more than that one play being a cause for demise, it was Buck's big picture style and affinity for unproductive veterans that overall probably led to the malaise in the clubhouse. Coupled with Duquette's complete and utter inability to gather virtually ANY younger productive talent (the next wave to fill in for MacPhail's core).
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#132 bmore_ken

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 06:58 PM

The hitting is only part of it. His contract has handcuffed the team and contributed to the fire sale and rebuild. On the field the all or nothing offense was a bigger problem than the pitching but I don't want to start that argument again.

Wrong. What money did the team spend before he signed that contract? 



#133 Dystopia

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 09:14 PM

The hitting is only part of it. His contract has handcuffed the team and contributed to the fire sale and rebuild. On the field the all or nothing offense was a bigger problem than the pitching but I don't want to start that argument again.

Well, that and the terrible record.



#134 JoyinMudville

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:28 PM

a home run today...

 

Man, I would love to be wrong about my post on his inevitable decline.



#135 NewMarketSean

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:50 PM

a home run today...

 

Man, I would love to be wrong about my post on his inevitable decline.

I think we all would like that.

 

But he's not going to be the 2013 or 2015 Davis ever again.

 

At this point we can only hope for some small return on the investment.

 

A .210 / 25 / 70 kind of small return.

 

And him getting to .210 after his start would be a miracle.


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#136 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:57 PM

If he could just be something close to 2016 Davis, that would be fine...  not sure if even that is realistic, though.



#137 Mackus

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 03:00 PM

The question I've found most interesting is what will they do if he recovers so that the isn't horrible on the scale of last season but ends up as a quite below average 1B/DH.  If he settles in as a 205/305/420 hitter, how long do you keep paying him?  Because that's still barely replacement level.  



#138 NewMarketSean

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 03:07 PM

The question I've found most interesting is what will they do if he recovers so that the isn't horrible on the scale of last season but ends up as a quite below average 1B/DH.  If he settles in as a 205/305/420 hitter, how long do you keep paying him?  Because that's still barely replacement level.  

 

When someone from the minors pushes him, or the Orioles don't want to tank any longer.


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#139 DJ MC

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 03:07 PM

The question I've found most interesting is what will they do if he recovers so that the isn't horrible on the scale of last season but ends up as a quite below average 1B/DH.  If he settles in as a 205/305/420 hitter, how long do you keep paying him?  Because that's still barely replacement level.  

 

I think at that point it becomes a question of actually trying to develop or acquire a prospect to play first base, since replacement-level is what you're going to get either way.

 

Or, if Mancini is viewed as the long-term answer at first, the answer is pretty much still the same as now, where Davis plays until someone forces their way into the outfield and demands Mancini play elsewhere. Even then, once Trumbo is officially gone you could just leave Davis at DH semi-permanently until the development/acquisition of further offensive talent requires the roster and lineup spot.


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#140 Hooded Viper

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 03:10 PM

When someone from the minors pushes him, or the Orioles don't want to tank any longer.

 

Trey Mancini says hello!  His D is better at 1st than anywhere else.






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