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MASN: Revisiting Elias’ comments on Davis


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#1 BSLChrisStoner

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 11:46 AM

MASN: Revisiting Elias’ comments on Davis
http://www.masnsport...s-on-davis.html



#2 BSLRobShields

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 11:54 AM

Obviously, it’s going to be an analytical approach, showing him why what he’s doing isn’t working and what the numbers suggest.
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#3 CA-ORIOLE

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 01:28 PM

Sounds like they will present him different options to try/consider that almost certainly haven't been presented to him thus far by coaching. As it should be. I'm skeptical it will work in Davis' case, but it needs to be done. This is one of the reasons the manager/coaching staff selections are important. 


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#4 Dystopia

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 02:35 PM

I mean, things have nowhere to go but up for Davis



#5 JTrea81

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 03:17 PM

The shift has messed with Davis' head IMO.  I believe Houston uses it quite a bit defensively so I would think that Elias would know it's weaknesses and be able to exploit them.

 

It will certainly help having analytics presented to Davis instead of more old-school approaches like just watching video of his swings.



#6 BSLRobShields

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 03:34 PM

The shift has messed with Davis' head IMO. I believe Houston uses it quite a bit defensively so I would think that Elias would know it's weaknesses and be able to exploit them.

It will certainly help having analytics presented to Davis instead of more old-school approaches like just watching video of his swings.


The “old school” approaches are 100% needed.

However, they need to combine with numbers and newer thinking.
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#7 BSLSteveBirrer

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 03:45 PM

It is silly that the shift has gotten into his head (if that is the case). He didn't need to change anything in his approach for that. The whole bunt, do to left field was all garbage. If he hits the ball hard on the nose how much does the shift really cut down on his hits? Fact is if he hits it our or off the wall then no freaking defense is going to stop that.


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#8 BSLRobShields

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 04:10 PM

The “he should just bunt” crowd is annoying to me.

Sure, every once in a while he could/should do that.

But it’s not like he should do that all the time.

And if he does it every once in a while, it’s not like teams are going to defense him any differently.
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#9 Mackus

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 04:10 PM

It is silly that the shift has gotten into his head (if that is the case). He didn't need to change anything in his approach for that. The whole bunt, do to left field was all garbage. If he hits the ball hard on the nose how much does the shift really cut down on his hits? Fact is if he hits it our or off the wall then no freaking defense is going to stop that.

 

The shift didn't take him from 250 down to 180, but it definitely has an impact.  Teams wouldn't shift if it didn't help. 

 

It's impossible to say how much it impacts Chris, because he faces the shift almost exclusively, so there is no "control" of non-shift PAs to compare it to.  Since 2014, he's only had 54 PAs where he put the ball in play that were not against the shift, compared to over 1300 balls in play against the shift.

 

2013 was the only year there were a decent number of balls hit both into the shift (227) and into a traditional defense (108).  He had a 694 OPS on balls in play against the shift and a 1052 OPS on balls in play against traditional defense.  This of course doesn't count homeruns, strikeouts, or walks, which are a substantial percentage of Davis' plate appearances.



#10 bmore_ken

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 05:54 PM

  This of course doesn't count homeruns, strikeouts, or walks, which are a substantial percentage of Davis' plate appearances.

This is the main point. The shift doesn't cause you to go from 26 homers to 16


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#11 Mike B

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 06:27 PM

This is the main point. The shift doesn't cause you to go from 26 homers to 16

I think Davis's problem started because of the shift, and have mushroomed from there.  I think Chris has made so many small changes to combat it, he has no feel for what is the right way any more.  IMO, paralysis by analysis.


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#12 russsnyder

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 07:27 PM

I think the problem is that he can't hit.

The idea that the shift has gotten into his head is a poor excuse.

His bat is slow and he has virtually no plan at the plate.

Like Ken pointed out, he hit 16 homers last season. That's pathetic.

#13 Dystopia

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 08:20 PM

I think the problem is that he can't hit.

The idea that the shift has gotten into his head is a poor excuse.

His bat is slow and he has virtually no plan at the plate.

Like Ken pointed out, he hit 16 homers last season. That's pathetic.

Exactly, this guy is supposed to be a 35+ homer guy. Shift ain't gonna do shit if the ball leaves the yard.



#14 Mike B

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Posted 23 November 2018 - 09:54 PM

I have a feeling this thread can be merged with the last Chris Davis thread and see if it gets to 100 pages and 2,000 post.


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#15 CA-ORIOLE

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Posted 24 November 2018 - 12:37 AM

The bunting stuff was pretty stupid. At the very least I suppose he was willing to try something different.....even if it was dumb. 



#16 birdwatcher55

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Posted 24 November 2018 - 09:09 AM

Put a fork in him. He's done!

#17 Nigel Tufnel

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Posted 05 December 2018 - 03:50 PM

There's some talk about MLB banning the shift.  I think that's a bad idea, but it would definitely help Davis.



#18 birdwatcher55

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Posted 05 December 2018 - 04:03 PM

It's about time.

#19 weird-O

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Posted 06 December 2018 - 05:35 PM

There's some talk about MLB banning the shift.  I think that's a bad idea, but it would definitely help Davis.

I don't like the idea. I think the shift is an evolution of the game, just like the role the bull pen now plays, or even way back to when Candy Cummings first threw a curve ball. I'm not saying I like all the ways the game has evolved. It's boring to see 1/2 innings last 25 minutes because of all the throwing over to 1B and multiple pitching changes. But if you start removing strategy, in the name of reduced game times and increased offense (two frequent complaints about the game) is that really baseball? 

 

Perhaps the shift will lead to another evolution, but on the offensive side. Maybe Chris Davis types will fade away as teams draft and develop more complete hitters that offer multiple dimensions to their offensive game. Personally, I would love to see that kind of baseball return to prominence.   


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Good news! I saw a dog today.


#20 bmore_ken

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Posted 06 December 2018 - 05:48 PM

There's some talk about MLB banning the shift.  I think that's a bad idea, but it would definitely help Davis.

I don't see how it helps him. You don't go from 26 homers to 16 because of the shift. Maybe it helps him get above the Mendoza line, but Davis is only a career .238 hitter anyway. You can live with .240 when you accompany it with 35-40 homers and he hasn't been that guy in a few years.


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