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#61 Crouseman

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 01:44 PM

This is the type of player we should look at it.

 

One of the most disgusting things about last years team is the total inability to catch the ball.   I can get behind a rebuild, but I can not stomach watching a team give their opponents 4 outs or more an inning.

 

Fix SS, 3B, left and right field defensively/

Agree. That 60 rating on his fielding and arm is enough to take a stab at this guy.  I mean really what do we have to lose -  DFAing Susac to create a 40 man spot???  LOL!!!   SS is pretty much a black hole n the minors.  I think Adam Hall is the only legit prospect I can think of.  And he is way low in the minors.  Low A ball I think.



#62 Crouseman

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 01:45 PM

I think there are one or 2 pitchers in the rule 5 that Elias drafted when he was with Houston. 



#63 BSLRobShields

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 01:50 PM

Agree. That 60 rating on his fielding and arm is enough to take a stab at this guy.  I mean really what do we have to lose -  DFAing Susac to create a 40 man spot???  LOL!!!   SS is pretty much a black hole n the minors.  I think Adam Hall is the only legit prospect I can think of.  And he is way low in the minors.  Low A ball I think.

Granier is the guy I am sure they have earmarked.

 

But adding this guy makes sense.  

 

Iglesias is another guy who makes sense.


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#64 Mackus

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 01:51 PM

SS is pretty much a black hole n the minors. I think Adam Hall is the only legit prospect I can think of.

Cadyn Grenier was a 1st round pick (Comp A) in this past draft.

He sounds pretty similar to Martin, actually, big glove no bat.

#65 Crouseman

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 01:58 PM

Cadyn Grenier was a 1st round pick (Comp A) in this past draft.

He sounds pretty similar to Martin, actually, big glove no bat.

Oh yeah forgot about him.  I'd still take a chance on Martin.  If nothing else with his glove you could hide him as a utility infielder next year. And really who cares if he can't hit much next year if he does play a lot at SS.  He can try and out duel Davis to see who can crack .170.



#66 CA-ORIOLE

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 03:41 PM

Be fine with Beckham coming back at SS. I think he made 2 errors at SS in his last 30 games after adjusting from injuries and getting dicked around with the position change. I think he just needed to settle in and would project him average to slightly below average defensively at the position gong forward with dedicated time and commitment there. Would have liked to have seen more offense in the second half but he came up from a 479 OPS to 661 after the injury. I think he hit into a bit of bad luck as well. I could see Nunez/Beckham/Villar/Mancinci being 3/3.5 WAR players next year in the IF and providing average defense. Potentially all 4 being mid-season trade chips. I don't really feel Villar at SS. He may make less errors than Beckham there, which I suppose would proved some people comfort, but his range and athletic ability would likely make him worse defender than Beckham imo. So (barring the acquisition of a young ML ready stud second baseman), would prefer keeping Villar at second base. We have some smart people now. I'm sure they'll figure something out and make an intelligent decision. 


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#67 JeremyStrain

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Posted 21 November 2018 - 04:45 PM

In a Rule 5 pick you probably aren't getting a ready starter. You probably aren't getting a SP than can start in the majors. You're hoping that you get someone that can hang through the season and pick up some experience, someone that can contribute in the BP or bench is most likely, and a guy that plays good defense at SS isn't a bad gamble. You are going to punt your UTIL bench position if you do it, but if his defense is that good it may not be a bad decision, and defense can make mediocre pitching better, we saw that a few years here already.


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#68 TheGuru

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 08:40 AM

Baseball America mentioned this guy:

“Oakland A’s SS Richie Martin has long faced questions about his bat, but he’s a true shortstop with at least above-average range and a plus arm. In his third stint at Double-A Midland, he hit .302/.370/.442. As a shortstop with some success hitting in Double-A, he immediately becomes a very interesting Rule 5 candidate.”

I’d take this guy and plug him in the lineup everyday. The Orioles are in full rebuild mold. Let Martin keep the seat warm until Bobby Witt Jr is ready for the big leagues.

#69 Mackus

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 09:32 AM

Martin sounds like a great Rule 5 candidate but he's not someone you plug in everyday and the idea of playing him for 3+ seasons until Witt is ready (if he is even the pick which is far from guaranteed) is way overboard.

Add him, make him the utility guy, slowly increase his opportunities, and see if he can develop into something more.

His glove gives him much higher chance of developing into a starter than most Rule 5 guys. The bar for his bat is really low if he's a plus defender at SS. A 650 OPS would be enough in that case. Last year in AA was the first time he's exceeded that as a pro, however.
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#70 clapdiddy

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:02 AM

Martin sounds like a great Rule 5 candidate but he's not someone you plug in everyday and the idea of playing him for 3+ seasons until Witt is ready (if he is even the pick which is far from guaranteed) is way overboard.

Add him, make him the utility guy, slowly increase his opportunities, and see if he can develop into something more.

His glove gives him much higher chance of developing into a starter than most Rule 5 guys. The bar for his bat is really low if he's a plus defender at SS. A 650 OPS would be enough in that case. Last year in AA was the first time he's exceeded that as a pro, however.

 

If this guy can pick it, I have no idea why you wouldn't just hand him the job.   It's not like this team is competing for the playoffs, and a competent defense would help out the pitching.


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#71 Mackus

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:11 AM

If this guy can pick it, I have no idea why you wouldn't just hand him the job.   It's not like this team is competing for the playoffs, and a competent defense would help out the pitching.

 

If he's the best option in ST, then he can start, he would have earned it.  But if he gets outplayed, then he doesn't.  Just because you are rebuilding and you don't necessarily have to win games, you don't just give out starting MLB positions to any young guy with a pulse.  It's the same reason we aren't starting Paul Fry on Opening Day.  You still play your best players.  If we take Martin and that's him, then play him.  But handing him the job, which to me means it won't matter how he looks in ST or how he performs once the season starts for a long period of time, I don't think that's who he is yet.  I would do that with an encouraging prospect who has proven all he has to at the minors.  I don't think that's Martin, who's only had one decent season at AA with the bat.  But I would like to acquire him and find out if he can become a regular everyday SS.  I'd have to learn more about other available guys to know if there might be a better option with that Rule 5 pick, but he sounds like a good candidate.


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#72 dude

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:28 AM

Martin sounds like a great Rule 5 candidate but he's not someone you plug in everyday and the idea of playing him for 3+ seasons until Witt is ready (if he is even the pick which is far from guaranteed) is way overboard.

Add him, make him the utility guy, slowly increase his opportunities, and see if he can develop into something more.

 

I don't really get these comments either.

 

I'd have actually suggested they could start Cadyn Grenier this season....because if the glove is ready, he's hitting 9th and you see what happens.  Not a guy you really worry about service time with and if you want to keep him longer (FA), he's not a big cost guy.

 

Martin is Grenier with more MiL experience so if you wanted to go the Martin route, you can take a swing at that and slow-play Grenier a little.  Grenier doesn't even have to be on the 40 for a while.



#73 Mackus

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:33 AM

Because we have no idea if he can play well enough to be a major leaguer.  If he has a 450 OPS, you can't start him, even on the worst team in the league.

 

I'm all for giving him a roster spot and a chance.  But making him the starting SS without regard for performance or current capabilities is not an idea I can support.  It's still a merit-based game.  Earn your opportunity.  Martin has earned a roster spot with his play at AA, at least he has given the constraints on him the Rule 5 status would come with.  But he has yet to earn more than that. 



#74 dude

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:34 AM

 It's not like this team is competing for the playoffs, and a competent defense would help out the pitching.

 

Can I just add that playing him or not playing him doesn't really mean you aren't competing for the playoffs.  i get that nobody wants to compete, but you aren't asking him to hit leadoff.  He's playing defense and batting 9th.  Do more with the rest of the lineup and he's fine.



#75 dude

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 11:42 AM

I didn't re-read the first couple pages but Addison Russell is 100% available and likely at a reasonable cost. 

 

Chicago likely needs to move on so they need to do something with him.

 

I don't know the (real?) details on his situation (I guess that could change things) but he's an easy buy low guy right now.  

 

Probably not starting for Cubs next season...so he's starting somewhere else.



#76 russsnyder

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 02:22 PM

I didn't re-read the first couple pages but Addison Russell is 100% available and likely at a reasonable cost.

Chicago likely needs to move on so they need to do something with him.

I don't know the (real?) details on his situation (I guess that could change things) but he's an easy buy low guy right now.

Probably not starting for Cubs next season...so he's starting somewhere else.

According to Sportrac, Russell is due 3 million in 2019. Further, he is suspended through the first 29 games of 2019. His price tag is low, but I'd pass. I prefer to go with someone with less baggage.
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#77 russsnyder

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 02:36 PM

I don't really get these comments either.

I'd have actually suggested they could start Cadyn Grenier this season....because if the glove is ready, he's hitting 9th and you see what happens. Not a guy you really worry about service time with and if you want to keep him longer (FA), he's not a big cost guy.

Martin is Grenier with more MiL experience so if you wanted to go the Martin route, you can take a swing at that and slow-play Grenier a little. Grenier doesn't even have to be on the 40 for a while.


Greiner played 43 games in low A last season. Starting him at SS at the MLB level in 2019 would be throwing this kid to the wolves. Hopefully, he plays well at Frederick with an eye on moving to Bowie. I don't see the need to rush this kid with a rule 5 option like Martin and other options available.
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#78 CA-ORIOLE

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 02:37 PM

I agree with Mackus' take is that you select Martin as a utility player initially and go form there. One year or not, the offensive bump last year is pretty intriguing (It looks like he had a lesser bump in A+ in 2017 as well, so theoretically an upward trend).



#79 russsnyder

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 02:47 PM

I agree with Mackus' take is that you select Martin as a utility player initially and go form there. One year or not, the offensive bump last year is pretty intriguing (It looks like he had a lesser bump in A+ in 2017 as well, so theoretically an upward trend).


I think this makes a lot of sense. You get a defender with upside that you can ease into the lineup and he's cheap.

#80 dude

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Posted 22 November 2018 - 03:51 PM

According to Sportrac, Russell is due 3 million in 2019. Further, he is suspended through the first 29 games of 2019. Hus price tag is low, but I'd pass. I prefer to go with someone with less baggage.

 

No idea why you mention the money but he is arbitration eligible and was a Super-2 last year.  MLBTR has him at 4.3 which is good enough for general purposes.  No idea why you'd care about the first 29 games.  I get the baggage but that is likely irrelevant 6 months from now.

 

Not trying to talk you or anyone into anything, Russell is just a quality SS that is reasonably available.

 

6 months ago, people were discussing him as the centerpiece for a Machado trade.  Now you get to buy at 10 cents on the dollar.






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